Locks and Mages: Back to balance
garreth — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 08:16
From WoR:
Mages & Warlock DPS (src)
Warlocks got to crazy land with the % modifiers to their damage output (specifically with Demonic Sacrafice), that's been toned down. Warlocks should never be able to out DPS a Mage with no pet out. Alike a Hunter, their pet should factor into their total damage output. Warlocks that sacrifice pretty much all utility talents should come very close to Mage DPS, but those who invest in group/raid utility should be lower.
Looks like locks and mages will be back on par in Wrath.
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Eh. Whatever. Though I
Tankard — Tue, 08/12/2008 - 16:27Eh. Whatever. Though I agree that the sac spec sucks. I miss having more than one dps spell to use in raid. Based on some of the talent tree changes they might even turn fire locks viable. Too bad they aren't giving us Shadowbolt Volley. That'd be fun as hell.
It will be interesting to
Mashedtater — Mon, 08/11/2008 - 20:16It will be interesting to see how it turns out. Maybe I will knock the dust off of Mashedtater and do more than make biscuits.
MIGHTY FIRESTONE!!! Insert
Gares of War — Mon, 08/11/2008 - 11:21MIGHTY FIRESTONE!!!
Insert Firestone tire joke here
I'm really excited to have
garreth — Mon, 08/11/2008 - 10:52I'm really excited to have full affliction locks back in raid. It was really sad how all encounters become "ZOMFG DPS RACE!!!!ONE" and the nuance and synnergy of optimal debuffs was thrown out the window in favor of enrage timers.
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I must second Dikymo's
Olorien — Mon, 08/11/2008 - 10:44I must second Dikymo's thoughts on the Demo/Sac Spec. I look forward to being able to spec in to Affliction again and not be embarrassed evertime I am in a raid with Watches.
P.S. I miss you guys LF1M
Yes I remember when I would
Dikymo — Mon, 08/11/2008 - 00:19Yes I remember when I would sit for most of a MC run and just get switched in for garr. I am used to the nerfs. bring em on.
P.S. I hate the destro sac spec.
Secretary vice president to the vice president's secretary of the department of redundancy department
Buffs and Debuffs are both
Dufe — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 16:47Buffs and Debuffs are both valuable. CoE/CoR/CoT are AT LEAST as valuable as AI, plus you get to do ~400 dps more personal dps in best in game gear.
"I'll just tank if warlocks are expected to be less than what they are now."
That's exactly what mages feel like rgiht now - less than a warlock.
Gares you forgot the
Dragonspear — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 16:03Gares you forgot the healthstone
There is no Emotion; There is Peace.
There is no Ignorance; There is Knowledge.
There is no Passion; There is Serenity.
There is no Death; There is The Force.
~Jedi Code
Warlocks have viable buffs
Gares of War — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 15:14Warlocks have viable buffs
Underwater breathing
Detect Invisibility
I need these every raid.
Look at it from a mage
Disrupter — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 16:01Look at it from a mage perspective Epatrick.
What viable buffs do mages bring to a sunwell raid?
AI isn't needed anymore, you can have alt mages conjure tables for the raid or buy your own food/water. And amp magic is so situational, it doesn't generally make the difference, They don't have ANY synergy at all outside of other mages, and don't bring alot to a raid.
While a warlock can spam shadowbolt, do 500+ more dps, and make the casters dps increase by 10%, the melees substantially (don't know the exact armor reduction) bring health stones to help healing on the fights, and if not given an spriest, it's ok, you can just tap when you need to move.
A mage is gimp compared to a warlock in sunwell, so gimp, that a t5 level moonkin can be more beneficial to the raid as a whole, then a mage could. :(
You kinda forget that pre
Epatrick — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 15:09You kinda forget that pre 1.6 locks were basically hk fodder, subpar dps and clothies with no CC. for god's sake they had to give us a free mount just to entice people to play warlock. I don't see why a warlock shouldn't be able to output as much if not more dmg than a mage, seeing as how we have no reliable buffing abilities, very mana intense spells (shadowbolt is still the pre bc version btw lol)
We turned into dps gods pre bc when the 70 talents came out, and immediately got smacked like wiffle balls on a tee by the nerf bat. lawl @ their nerfs to shadowpriests to nerf us indirectly. I'd love to use my pet to dps, or have more than one viable tree/cookie cutter spec to dps. alas, eat my balls blizzard, I'll just tank if warlocks are expected to be less than what they are now.
is true Dragon /agree with
Atakheal — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 13:37is true Dragon /agree with u
Chain Heal FTW
Olorien I would like to
Dragonspear — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 14:13Olorien I would like to thank you for that joke.
Most Nerfed Classes in World of Warcraft since release.
1. Warrior
2. Mage
3. Paladin & Shaman(note: This is a far pace behind the first 2 as since TBC has been released it has pretty much been a mixed bag of nerfs and buffs)
There is no Emotion; There is Peace.
There is no Ignorance; There is Knowledge.
There is no Passion; There is Serenity.
There is no Death; There is The Force.
~Jedi Code
Well, when a class is
Dufe — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 13:13Well, when a class is "unbalanced" there are only two options:
1) Nerf that class.
2) Buff all the others.
Option 1 is easier to do technically/balance-wise and probably makes the most sense overall. Bliz does OVERALL tend to do 2 more often though due to all the QQing about nerfs - regardless of their appropriateness.
thanks for the nerf!!!
Atakheal — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 12:40thanks for the nerf!!! hate locks
Chain Heal FTW
Welcome to rogue country.
saedo — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 12:39Welcome to rogue country. Population: QQ
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I know I speak for all locks
Olorien — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 12:36I know I speak for all locks when I say...
Why can't blizzard release a patch that does not have a lock nerf in it?
I mean seriously, every patch.
I think what Dufe means to
karlizeth — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 10:32I think what Dufe means to say is:
NERF LOCKS AND ROGUES KK?
Its going to be a lock nerf.
Agoney — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 10:15Its going to be a lock nerf. Blizz wants them to keep their pets out more often rather then sacing it seems.
I wonder if that will be
Dufe — Fri, 08/08/2008 - 08:51I wonder if that will be Lock nerfs or Mage buffs? Sounds like Lock nerfs unfortunately.
As a funny aside, a few quotes from the original WoW game manual:
"Mages can dish out the most ranged damage in the shortest time."
"They exist to blast monsters from range. In fact, in this role, they are unrivaled by all other classes. Only the rogue can hope to approach the massive amount of damage the mage can put out, and even then, the rogue must go within melee range to do so."
I know it's been so long since release that we couldn't expect the original manual's game balance to be fully appicable. It's just humorous since hunters, locks, and rogues can all easily out-dps mages in end game even in with full best-in-slot gear.